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Apr

24

If you liked TNR’s cover? You will LOVE this


Read this piece by Tom Hayden first.

Now, read why Tom Hayden,

is employing an ancient literary-political device, in which a man wards off charges of sexism by citing the example of a woman: I’m not averse to votes for women, but my wife, sir, won’t hear of it! Barbara is female — so that makes it okay for Hayden quote her comparing Hillary Clinton to “a screech on the blackboard” and Lady Macbeth. Because those are certainly similes that have never been used before! And that have no misogynist connotations, as in a woman who seeks public power is shrill and strident, a would-be despot who’ll stop at nothing to achieve her evil ends, and is just so darn unlikeable, too. So bitter!

Exactly. Thank you again, Katha Pollitt.

So many women to emulate, so little time.

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By Jill Miller Zimon at 7:03 pm April 24th, 2008 in Barack Obama, Blogging, Civil Rights, Culture, Debates, Gender, Government, Hillary Clinton, Social Issues, WH2008, Women, Writing 

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9 Responses to “If you liked TNR’s cover? You will LOVE this”

  1. 1 Chris Baker on April 24th, 2008 8:06 pm

    That’s one of the reasons I put so much pressure on Mrs Editor to blog. There were things about race and sex that I could talk about with her that I could never say in a public forum. She, on the other hand, could let loose. Not that I had any control over what she had to say, which in general was harsher that anything from me. I am, after all, the feminist in the family.

    Frankly, the age of outrage is over. It jumped the shark when I helped raise $250,000 for Paul Hackett over a crack by a supporter that Jean Schmidt made the mistake of being nice to. (A tactic I call binding. O the irony that I have to suffer through so much of it now.) Outrage to raise funds, rally supporters or damage an opponent is really opportunism.

  2. 2 Oengus on April 24th, 2008 11:41 pm

    Did you shoot the messenger?

    Why Women Hate Hillary

    “Maybe women like me are being extra hard on Hillary because she’s a woman. After all, baby boomer women couldn’t be “as good” as men in school or the workplace; we had to be better, to prove that women deserved equal opportunities. And this is part of the problem too. We don’t want the first female president to be Joe Lieberman in drag, pushing Bush-lite politics. We expect something better”

    http://www.inthesetimes.com/article/3129/why_women_hate_hillary/

    How flipping offensive is it to refer to a woman that you do not approve of as patriarchal?

    The Monster Woman

    “Feminists see her as a woman operating in the world against the odds; her triumph is theirs. . . . Some middle-aged boomers see in her the last rise of the ethos of the 60′s, the ethos of their youth; if she succeeds it means their era, and their investment in it, had meaning.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/books/00/03/19/reviews/000319.19oresket.html

    There a lot of hair pulling going on, other similes would be scratching and biting. Its mostly conservative woman, about a dozen books written about her and not advocating her pretty much bashing her.

    Clintons a moderate, I like her, she offends the fringes.

    If you aspire for the top its best to climb and not just knock down those around you, if you encounter an immovable object, go around it.

    A young girl was left to watch the stand at the market, a man approached her, he said; “ I want to buy all your onions”, she replied; “I cannot sell you all my onion, what will I have to sell tomorrow”.

  3. 3 oengus on April 25th, 2008 12:58 pm

    a symbol of the independent, rebellious, sensual, courageous, passionate, rageful potential in us all

    who was the first, first wife?

    From the dawn of time, why do we keep repeating ourselves?

    http://www.ciis.edu/faculty/birnbaum.html

    I like Lucia she wanted to get to the root of the behavior.

    History is so twisted and distorted, always the Shepard leading the sheep, were all the sheep black at one time, thats another story.

    One mantra or another its all the same to me, my agenda is detachment always the outsider looking in.

    Logic would say that it is most efficient to go around the obstacle, ignore it. Then again you could have a charter of addressing the obstacle, seek it out address it even make some money through addressing it. You could end up with a book signing at Burrows, with a bunch of females in comfortable shoes smiling at you. That is boring to me, unless they want to throw football around in parking lot.

    I found such humor in Senators Clinton embellishing her experience in Bosnia; I thought oh my god she got caught bullshitting. You have to watch that because bullshitters believe their own bullshit sometimes. I like her though she pays a very high attention to details; it was actually an interesting embellishment. Does she run, I mean other than for political offices could she run away from actual harm? I like physical prowess in a leader it must be a boy thing; hmm I wonder if that is why Bush won? Yep a guys guy and yep some girls like that, in fact its the center point of normal.

    The kid’s do they suffer. I mean does the nanny do the job. I would not suggest a young attractive one, go ahead reinvent the wheel I’ll watch its entertaining.

  4. 4 Eric on April 25th, 2008 1:36 pm

    For the record. My wife hates Hillary too. I guess that makes me an official misogynist!

  5. 5 Anonymous on April 25th, 2008 6:26 pm

    No Eric, your statement about your wife not liking Hillary doesn’t make you a misogynist it just illustrates that you did not comprehend the literary device being discussed. Which was:

    Using your wife to assist you in a public Hillary bash or any woman bashing, is equivalent to a white guy saying his black friend told him “it’s okay to say nigga” . Maybe his friend did say it was okay but if he feels so uncomfortable that he has to state that ahead of time perhaps he should rethink why he wants to say it in the first place.

    I wanted to hear why the authors wife doesn’t like Hillary but he really didn’t go into that, he just used her to introduce the reader to his ideas about Hillary.

  6. 6 oengus on April 26th, 2008 1:59 am

    Ok I will explain, Lilith was the first first wife.

    That is what Lucia Birbaum delved into, she also gets into black Madonna’s, I asked a Franciscan nun once, is it ok to lie, she replied; no it’s a sin. I replied; then is it a sin to represent Christ with blond hair and blue eyes. She was remarkably receptive to the question she explained that he is represented in way that you could relate to.

    Back to Lilith a Talmudic passage indicates she was Adams first wife and is for the most part adressing the aspect of feminity that some men have or find the most troubling.

    I supose that Lilth was the child of a male imagination, then to elevate her as some femimist do is or presents an interesting dicotomy.

    Then you have Eve as the “better women” again the child of a male imagination however she can not resist the serpent, which represents Lilith.

    Men have gone to great lengths in attempt to figure these things out, some anyways, the ying and the yang. I do believe though that you really have to look closer at the individuals, some men have trouble with the sexuality, they have to be on top.

    With repects to statistical equality keep in mind that woman have the option of being a homemaker and many men supported that historically. When you address pay differntials do you simulatenously address men supporting two homes, the first wife and the second wife.

    If you are not paid enough then ask for a raise, if they say no then you must not have value. I have a man sitting next to me that has three children and a wife, should I complain if he makes more than me? Its debateable so is it that he gets three tax write offs, I am paying for his family. He is favored he gets paid more and even his wife and kids get medical benefits. He costs more, why is he favored?

    Because it is a society and based on a family and not on the individual. I personally think that any intiative for change has to address that holistically and with out full dislosure it is not possible. Logic would say that having children should represent a cost not a discount, particularly in a society that has diminishing resources.

  7. 7 Jill Miller Zimon on April 27th, 2008 4:36 pm

    Chris, I know we had an email exchange but thanks for that comment. I totally understand what you’re saying and on different issues, the same thing can happen.

    That’s very interesting what you say about opportunism’s role in all this. I guess that ties into negative campaigning. I will never forget Chris Redfern saying, after the 2006 elections, that if you don’t like negative campaigning, don’t give money to candidates who use it.

    But how practical is that? And then again, would it be practical enough if we all applied it?

    Anyway – thanks for reading and commenting.

  8. 8 Jill Miller Zimon on April 27th, 2008 4:42 pm

    Oengus – I’ll to be chronological/orderl but I apologize if I’m not:

    1. The In These Times piece:

    I don’t go for the “we want a woman but not this woman.” That argument should be “we want a candidate but not this candidate.” Otherwise, we are never going to encourage women to run – so what if they lose? They need to run – just to be there, even if it is to lose. The lines about wanting one but not this one are harmful.

    2. Your second quote under the Monster title: yeah, but even so – everyone has their reasons for liking or not liking, supporting or not supporting. I can’t believe people still want to bang their heads trying to fit us all into neat piles. Just not happening.

    3. If you aspire for the top its best to climb and not just knock down those around you, if you encounter an immovable object, go around it.

    yeah – there’s some truth to that but it depends on the obstacles and whether battling them is in fact something that must be done.

    4. A young girl was left to watch the stand at the market, a man approached her, he said; “ I want to buy all your onions”, she replied; “I cannot sell you all my onion, what will I have to sell tomorrow”.

    Hmm – you lost me here – are you saying you think that’s wise? or she should have bargained?

  9. 9 Jill Miller Zimon on April 27th, 2008 4:44 pm

    Oengus in your #3 above – you ramblin’ son! :)

    Made some good points but I definitely don’t get the last reference and I’m not sure that being an outsider makes any of this better, even on an individual basis. Isn’t it really abdication?

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