Comments on: Why calling out is rooting out: Clinton-New Republic & Obamas-New Yorker

By: joe

joe — Thu, 17 Jul 2008 03:53:26 +0000

the vast majority of racists are black

By: Jill Miller Zimon

Jill Miller Zimon — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:27:10 +0000

I look forward to quoting you on that.

By: Mark McNally

Mark McNally — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:26:02 +0000

Where I am, is sitting back laughing my head off at you and Eric going 10 rounds in the battle of the protected classes. The most entertaining yet tediously sanctimonious PC battle royale of the year.

By: Anon

Anon — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:19:08 +0000

Kevin Drum wrote: If artist Barry Blitt had some real cojones, he would have drawn the same cover but shown it as a gigantic word bubble coming out of John McCain’s mouth — implying, you see, that this is how McCain wants the world to view Obama.

McCain spokesman Tucker Bounds: “We completely agree with the Obama campaign, it’s tasteless and offensive.”

By: Jill Miller Zimon

Jill Miller Zimon — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 19:40:12 +0000

Eric –

Did I actually write that Clinton “mentioning assassinations in June as a rationale for staying in the race was OK”?

By: John Ettorre

John Ettorre — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 19:02:05 +0000

Eric, we agree on this one. Let the debate be full and furious, and let the voters individually decide what’s fair vs. unfair, out of bounds vs. in. That’s just as it always has been in this country when it comes time to picking a president. As the old saying goes, politics ain’t beanbag.

And I admit I find the prissy League of Women Voters approach–trying to fit political elections and political debate into some kind of neat and tidy rules-based formula–a little unworkable in our system. We all learn something even from the most extreme speech, which we’re all free to ignore, ridicule, or whatever. That’s how the system’s worked for 230 years, and in the end, it tends to shed more than enough light on the subject, even if we also get some heat.

By: Eric

Eric — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:47:35 +0000

@9: well, i’m basing my memory on emails i just re-read.

By: everybody else is talking about it, why not me « Clueless White Woman

everybody else is talking about it, why not me « Clueless White Woman — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:35:19 +0000

[...] Filed under: Uncategorized — by clueless @ 5:35 pm Tags: cluelessness, CONSPIRACY! Yes, it’s that “satirical” Obama [...]

By: Jill Miller Zimon

Jill Miller Zimon — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:12:50 +0000

Trey Ellis says the same kind of thing here at HuffPo as Kevin Drum re: anything else would have been better to get the idea across as satire. Same for the HRC TNR cover. There is almost always a better way - but the profiteers and provocateurs choose what they choose without regard for the racism or sexism they reinforce. There are so many other, better ways.

By: Jill Miller Zimon

Jill Miller Zimon — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 17:04:43 +0000

Different memory there Eric. I raised the specifics of the image, then I was told that the image was nothing in the face of the June statement. I’ve never defended Clinton on that but I do find the image of Michelle Obama far more offensive. I did then and I do now.

I take no issue with your tactic in spinning the cover. That only reinforces the fact that it’s racist and wrong. That’s fine.

I’m saying that it’s a here we go again – because every time we don’t call out the fact that these things are at and expose the roots of racism and sexism, we’re just shoveling more dirt and giving them more fodder to grow.

I don’t want it to grow – and I don’t want them to be used or spun. I want them to be replaced by real discourse and change, Eric.

Spinning it as you are is fine – it’s another way of coping. And neutering something is one way of making sure it won’t grow again.

But it’s not the only way, and this incident with the New Yorker isn’t the only worthy of being called out. You disagree with me on that. So be it. But that’s not going to stop me from having that opinion.