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Oct
16
UPDATE from Toledo Blade: Joe the Plumber might be registered, but if it’s him, he voted Republican in the Ohio 3/08 primary.
I like Mara Liasson of NPR very much, but she opens her story about Joe the Plumber in the hourly news recap by calling him a “real voter” from Ohio (her longer story is here). Some reports say he’s from Toledo, but the Toledo Blade reports that he’s from Springfield Township which is in Clark County, Ohio, considerably south of Toledo and west of Columbus. But the Ohio part seems more or less accurate.
The problem is, it appears that Joe Wurzelbacher is not a registered voter in the state of Ohio, according to this Politico post but also my own search in the public records of Ohioan’s voter registration information, which you can access here. Comments in the Politico item suggest that Wurzelbacher may even be a close relation to someone connected to the Keating Five and Lincoln Savings & Loan collapse (here’s another post suggesting the Keating connection.)
You can read this lengthy and seemingly candid interview that was done just before the debate with Wurzelbacher. It was conducted by an editor of the conservative Family Security Matters. SourceWatch describes FSM as a front group for the Center for Security Policy think tank which may sound familiar to anyone who lives in a state whose legislature has pushed for its pension plans to divest from Iran (see more here about the efforts of Ohio State Rep. Josh Mandel (R-17, Lyndhurst) and Center for Security Policy to do so in Ohio).
Some background on FSM that bears on the differences between Obama and McCain: FSM has listed as the ten most dangerous organizations groups such as include ACLU, the Family Research Council, MoveOn.org, the Center for American Progress, “Universities and Colleges” and the blog Think Progress. Although the FSM link no longer seems to work, fellow The Ruckus blog, Crooks and Liars, has a corroborating post here. Also, FSM publishes a list of the ten most dangerous college courses which includes, “Whiteness and Multiculturalism,” “Intro to Labor Studies” and “Movements in Social Justice.”
Wurzelbacher’s interview with FSM portrays a man with a plan when it comes to speaking with Obama. “The American Dream” as a goal that Obama will keep from happening and the notion that “socialiam” and entitlements, without using the word “entitlements” – aking to evil four-letter words, all arise frequently as themes.
As for the notion that maybe Joe’s a conservative? Well, up until last night, the conservative talking heads were showing some love, according to Wurzelbacher himself:
Neil Cavuto, I was on his show earlier today, just a phone interview for about five minutes. He asked a couple of questions. Then a talk show – Trey Ware – he has a conservative talk show down in San Antonio, Texas – he picked up on it. I’ve had friends call me from all over the nation, saying they heard Rush Limbaugh quote something from me or they’ve heard Hannity quote something. I guess it’s getting quite a bit of play.
Sigh. I don’t know if Joe is registered somewhere. I don’t know who Joe has voted for in the past or if he’s voted in the past. And there seem to be no records of any political contributions ever made by Joe. Ultimately, only Joe knows Joe.
But here in Ohio, we have a history of political reporters picking out people at rallies and suggesting that they are stand-ins for an idea when in fact it turns out that they are ringers. A history that exists because bloggers did some checking on the MSM. And so this use of Wurzelbacher as a standardbearer for…something – an undecided voter? An average American voter? A voter of any kind? Just seems very, very…not standard or average.
Since, in the meantime, we have only the words that Joe, so far, has put on the record, I feel confident in concluding that he’s a fiscal and social conservative who, logic would tell us, was never going to like much of what Barack Obama proposes. In this regard, then, with last night’s debate performance, John McCain successfully baited the media and the public with a ringer. And where I come from, that’s just plain old deception.
Quick update: Joe won’t tell us who he’s voting for, according to Reuters:
The morning after he emerged as the unexpected star of Wednesday night’s presidential debate, Joe Wurzelbacher of Holland, Ohio, declined to say who he will vote for in the November 4 election.
“It’s a personal decision, and myself and the button I push will know the answer,” the 34-year-old plumber said on ABC’s “Good Morning America” program.
Could that be because he isn’t registered to vote? Again, only Joe knows for sure.
By Jill Miller Zimon at 9:48 am October 16th, 2008 in Barack Obama, Campaigning, Debates, John McCain, Ohio, Politics, Social Issues, WH2008
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22 Responses to “[updated] Joe the Plumber: Not likely a voter, very likely in the tank for all things conservative”
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The Toledo Blade has a morning update in their story (don’t know if it was there when you read it) that I believe explains what’s going on.
It reads, “Questions were being raised Thursday morning whether Mr. Wurzelbacher is a registered voter.
Linda Howe, executive director of the Lucas County Board of Elections, said a Samuel Joseph Worzelbacher, whose address and age match Joe the Plumber’s, registered in Lucas County on Sept. 10, 1992. He voted in his first primary on March 4, 2008, registering as a Republican.
Ms. Howe said that the name may be misspelled in the database.”
Also, there is a Springfield Township in Lucas County (as well as several other counties such as Summit and Clark).
http://www.city-data.com/township/Springfield-Lucas-OH.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Springfield_Township,_Ohio
Greg – thank you!!
By the way – if his name is in fact misspelled in the database? He is an example of those folks whose registration info does not match, right? But he is not one of the new registrations, if this is indeed him.
Specifically, Joe the Plumber is from Holland, Ohio, in Lucas County.
The big news, in an interview with Katie Couric last night after the debate, Joe the Plumber admitted that he did NOT earn $250K/year.
As far as the registration issue goes, I still have some questions: what is his father’s name, what does he do, and where does he live? There’s a lot more information to vet before this story grows legs.
Ironically – I feel the opposite. The more bluster the more obvious that Joe the Plumber is irrelevant and a distraction again.
McCain again miscalculated.
Interesting stuff. I didn’t know voter registration info and voting history was public info. Very surprised to be able to view my voting history since 2000. Also dismayed to see that on my street, over 50% of my neighbors, many of whom have who always seem to have strong opinions on various matters have not voted once in the last 8 years!!
I love Gladys! What would Bewitched have been without her? (it was Bewitched right?)
Yeah – I know – I discovered that “tool” several months ago. It is kind of scary – almost invasive – I’m not sure. But it came about under Blackwell or another GOP SOS I suspect so…there we have it.
Maybe ACORN should register Joe the Plumber and he will get to vote about ten times. Who cares who he is really? Does that mean that if he does not vote or that if he has a relative who works for whoever that there is not a plumber out there somewhere else just like him who will have his small business hurt by Obama’s tax plan? You are missing the point!!!!!!!
Natysha – I disagree that I’m missing the point – I think you are missing the point. If the McCain campaign wants to find a spokesperson for that concern about Obama’s tax plan, that’s fine. However, Joe the Plumber is not a credible spokesperson or icon that represents that concern. He isn’t undecided, he had no interest in giving Obama a chance – on the Katie Couric interview, he said that he wanted to corner Obama.
That’s deceptive.
Hey Greg,
Can we get the address he was registered at in 1992? Just curious… TIA.
Will K.,
To answer your question, I don’t really know.
I don’t think the info is available on-line. Probably would have to check in person with the Lucas County BOE. I have to admit, I don’t know how long county BOEs keep the original voter registration card and/or what happens to it if a person should move.
Will K.,
Meant to also add to the last comment, “Sorry that I can’t answer your question.”
Natasha,
You obviously don’t understand the difference between voting fraud and voter’s registration fraud or what happened with ACORN. Just because I sign up Winnie the Pooh for a voter’s registration card doesn’t mean that Winnie the Pooh can show up and vote in the election.
I agree with Jill 100%…Joe the plumber was a deceptive tactic. Like Jill said, Joe was not at the rally to really bounce ideas off of Obama. He wasn’t interested in what Obama had to say. He was there on an agenda.
I think Obama hit the nail on the head. All of these distractions McCain is using say more about his campaign than it does about Obama.
Alexandra -thanks for the comment.
Now, at this point? I think that what we did see that is sincere from Joe the plumber is the real frustration people who are fiscal or social conservatives have with McCain and/or Palin. I think Joe really wishes perhaps that he could just outright be out there for McCain – rather than do whatever it is that he did to try and show up Obama. Because if the GOP ticket was strong and competitive because it actually HAS strength and offered a solid choice, Joe Plumbers would make a lot of sense.
Instead, we get what we got last night.
Again – I was never a McCain person – in 2000 or before or since. But it cannot be easy for people who were – there’s just no way that he is now what he was then, for those supporters.
How was Joe a deceptive tactic? He was playing with his kid in the yard in Holland, Ohio (outside Toledo) when Obama came walking through the neighborhood. He did not attend an Obama rally. Don’t blame Joe because Obama got caught saying he wanted to redistribute wealth. The lesson is Obama should stick to his democrat rallies where he can’t be asked the hard questions, like explaining his proposed policies.
Joe may be a registered Republican, but I am a registered democrat who usually votes republican on national candidates. Registration means nothing.
Mike, thanks for reading and commenting.
Obama didn’t get caught saying what he’s said many, many times regarding his philosophy about his tax plan. It’s just not new. And clearly Joe was comfortable asking the questions and being seen on the record asking them. So to be fair, let’s get that out of the way.
My feeling that Joe’s approach and portrait of how this all went down is deceptive really came when I heard him say to Katie Couric that he really wanted to corner Obama. “Corner” is his word, Mike.
What is that all about?
Now – again – I know, I’m voting Obama, I don’t hide that here. But to try to be honest:
Let’s put this in the best light for Joe possible: that the media is using him and that John McCain decided to use him and that Joe can’t or couldn’t control that.
Ok – I’ll buy that.
But Joe CAN control what Joe says and what Joe tells others. To say “no one asked me” a certain question? Not okay.
Also, he’s quoted in one of the articles – I think it’s the Blade but I might be wrong, saying that he didn’t have any interviews with anyone before the debate.
But then how did the Family Security Matters interview show up with a date of 10/15?
Look – as I wrote, if McCain wants to use a plumber from Ohio as the symbol for the people whom McCain believes will have to pay more taxes under Obama’s plan, that’s McCain’s choice. It just so happens that it’s not an apt choice – it just isn’t, for all the ways in which Joe is not that plumber.
Why didn’t Joe just say – I’m not that plumber, but I just don’t like the philosophy? Why did Joe play along to make it look like Obama’s plans will negatively impact him?
That’s why I call his presentations deceptive.
I know you may disagree – and I’d be interested to read why, but I hope that makes sense.
Jill
My point was that Joe was not a set-up by anyone else to ask that question. Obama randomly was in that neighborhood. I will agree with you that Joe himself was deceptive in asking the question.
It appears that Joe may have caused himself alot of trouble considering he does not have a plumber’s license.
Personally, even though I may not agree with Obama, I would have been thrilled if a passibly future president had walked through my neighborhood. I would have smiled, shook his hand and kept my mouth shut.
Nevertheless, Obama’s policy is redistribution of wealth and does not set well with many people who work hard for where they got.
Mike – thanks – I think that’s very fair and honest, what you write.
Maybe the difference is only that this concept of redistribution, like the framing of the concept of “Socialism” or what it would mean to “win” the war on terror – they get very very politicized when the reality is, we all participate in the redistribution of wealth, everyday – because our gov’t says so and/or because we decide to do it (charity, volunteering, donating and so on).
Our country is enormous, we have huge problems of poverty that defy even the best financial circumstances. I don’t believe it’s possible to truly eliminate it and so I do support the existence of mechanisms that will help alleviate poverty for those who are in it.
If other people want to label that whatever they want to label it and then slander that label, I can only keep doing what I think is right and saying why I support it.
But for sure – the extent to which any of us support it is definitely a HUGE point of contention between people of different political ideologies.
Jill
Great research. Here’s what I don’t understand…the economics of this business.
If joe buys this business …the tax threshold would be clearing $250,000, not grossing…so if he owns the business and files personally, why does a higher tax rate keep him from hiring anyone. How much money is he making now? Plumbers should be well paid, but the economics here don’t add up. McCains aid Joe’s been working 7 days a week at this plumbing firm. Is Joe planning to abuse his workers in the same way? Why would anyone want to work for him if they don’t get Sunday off to go to church. Filing as a business (you can see this on Wall Street right now) he’ll be able to write off many many many expenses he as an individual pays for with after tax dollars, so essentially at 30% raise. Finally McCain insisted Joe would be fined for NOT providing health care. Well, why wouldn’t he just provide them with healthcare. Whether there’s a small business exception or not, why wouldn’t he treat his fictional employees fairly. If all employers did that, we wouldn’t be in this mess, would we?
Basically when mcCain says he doesn’t understand economics, it’s the truth.
Joe the Plumber is not connected to Keating.
I find it instructive that the Left is generally delighted to sift through the relationships, tax records, voter registration, professional training, and even relatives’ relationships of a plumber from Toledo. But these same people caterwaul when anyone dares to point out Obama’s lack of accomplishments, his refusal to fully disclose his past, his radical allies and advisors, his close ties to a crooked vote-rigging organization, and his complicity in the economic crisis.
Instructive, indeed.
Alo,
These issues have been dismissed by — dare I say it — Republican-approved organizations. I’m not going to debate the facts that you omit from your comments — it’s not worth the effort.
I do, however, want to thank you for astroturfing the Republican Party stump line. We really don’t have the opportunity to hear it enough.
Joe the Plumber is: a) not a plumber; b) possibly related to a member of the Keating Five family. He also has his own foibles.
But thanks again for the standard, “repeat the lies so much it becomes truth” Republican Party line.
As an Independent voter, and not yet an Obama supporter, I have to say that you make me sick with the lies.
Puhleeze. You’re as independent as a remora.
@19 Alo – the difference is between relying on conclusions as what to push as the meme and then examining the information the conclusions came from. Throw in a person’s world view and there you are.